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If you have any comments to make about any aspects of the Arboretum's restoration please submit your Comments HERE. For a more in-depth forum on the Arboretum, please use our Message Board This works the same way as the guest book, your comments will appear here after verification by our monitoring service Latest additions to the comments page are entered at the top of the list. Please note that the views expressed here are not necessarily supported by the author. All comments are of a personal nature and are published with that understanding.
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| The newly
renovated Arboretum looks great. It's a shame about the derelict
building as you enter from Normaton Road side, but I'm sure a business
will snap that up. The old building looks a lot better, and the
new windows at the Q-arts site looks fantastic, makes me look forward to
Derby in the next few years, with Format'05 later this year, and then
the Quad being built (Who knows, maybe Royal crown Derby will become the
new chavistrocratic trend!). Things like this do cost, but in the
end it will bring in far more tourists and help derby grow culturally
and financially. The idea that the Boar could be seen as offensive is the most ludicrous thing I've heard, political correctness gone way too far, Every Muslim viewpoint I've heard thinks it's stupid to say it could cause offense. Matt Hanchard <[email protected]> Derby, Derbyshire UK - Thursday, February 17, 2025 at 20:42:13 (GMT) |
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| More on the controversial Grove Street Triangle sculpture (Black Pudding) here | |
| Absolutely Chris - and the sooner
the Arboretum is returned to us the better. It remains a beautiful oasis
in deepest Normanton. All thanks go to Strutt for his foresight and
generosity. Dave Dave Johnson UK - Saturday, February 12, 2025 at 11:11:58 (GMT) |
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Author's comment: Dave, it has been suggested that I may be omitting comments that I do not agree with, I am therefore pleased that we have some differences of opinion on certain matters, namely art. I do hold historical accuracy as an essential element to attracting visitors from outside the area and the UK - yes the needs of the locals should be met as well, however, tourists will help to bring prosperity to the area and to the local businesses - this will benefit everyone living in the area. As to cleaning off the graffiti - I agree absolutely, it would have been wiser to clean it off before planting. Overall the Arboretum is returning to its original state, and will surely fulfill most of our hopes and expectations. Chris Harris
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| Chris I don't know quite where to go from here save to say that our tastes in matters sculptural differ. Of more interest to me on the issue is, given what you have reported of the Steering Group discussions on the subject, just how this particular piece came to be commissioned and what precedent has it set? Returning to the theme of my Message Board post 'Near Completion' on 20 November 2004, I can now see the light at the end of the proverbial tunnel. I am grateful to the project for the significant and, hopefully, enduring improvements made to the Arboretum / Recreational areas but remain in despair over the thoughtless lack of attention to overall detail or in some cases the apparent complete lack of awareness of what really matters to the regular users of the park facilities as opposed to the here-today gone-tomorrow civic dignitaries and tourists. Your report that the project is running low on finance no doubt referred to the initial capital outlay. Is there hope therefore that the outstanding tasks can be met from the maintenance budget that presumably kicks in as soon as the refurbishment phase is completed. If so, please add the following to my growing list of issues: . The graffiti on almost all the perimeter walls that was previously hidden by the original mature shrubs. Surely it would have been sensible to remove this before replanting. . Repairs and bulb replacement in both the traditional and new lighting. Some of the fixtures have been out of commission for several months. . The disgraceful state of the boundary fence running behind the Reginald Street properties. Arguably though, the fence, even in its current state of disrepair, is all that prevents open access to the Arboretum from many of these properties. However, if the deeds to my property are anything to go by, the owners surely have a legal responsibility to maintain their perimeter in good order. Perhaps the Council would care to enforce this! Dave Dave Johnson UK - Friday, February 11, 2025 at 20:39:24 (GMT)
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| Dave
Thanks for your comments, I suppose we can all try to convince ourselves that the sculpture has some relevance to the Arboretum. However during the early stages of this project I had the privilege of sitting on the Steering Group Committee, set up to offer guidance for the project organisers, promote local interest and set up a Friends Group. We had asked for permission to commission some works of art, carved from felled trees by Andrew Frost, a local tree artist, to be placed in the Arboretum. We were told that there would be NO "modern Art" of any kind permitted within the historical park, this area was only to represent the 1838 Loudon plan - which also excludes a bandstand! Check out Andrew Frost's website for some fine examples of work - which are far more acceptable and representative of an Arboretum - but were refused on the grounds that they are considered "Modern Art". We could have had several of these sculptures for half of the cost of the black pudding sculpture! Web Author Chris Harris |
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| More news along the lines of 'do
they think we don't notice'. I would be interested to hear the
explanation for the need to secure the entrance from the Arboretum to
the adjoining Reginald Street enclosure by nailing a piece of timber
across the top of the two new gates as I observed on Friday last. If the
contractors have no respect for the renovation work... Dave Dave Johnson UK - Sunday, February 06, 2025 at 14:40:47 (GMT) |
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| Caroline, try looking again at the
sculpture either as a represntation of a plant seed which I believe was
its inspiration or ,and this is my preferred interpretation, as a
representation of the sweep and curve of the Arboretum hills as seen on
maps of the original design or the aerial shot that is available
elsewhere on the site. Hope that helps Dave Dave Johnson UK - Sunday, February 06, 2025 at 14:47:54 (GMT) |
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| I don't mind the
developments in the wonderful Arboretum not being to the letter of the
original design. I love what has been done simply because it has been
done. There are elements I'm not keen on - the seating is smaller and
looks fragile, the urns look too black - more funereal than Victorian -
and I am just a little concerned about the pond area being abused with
shopping trolleys and the like. However, the one thing I find hardest is
the modern sculpture already mentioned. Not because it is modern but it
is too much like something I need to wipe off my shoe - there I said it
without saying the four letter word I want to use. I've tried looking at
it differently, to see beyond it's faecal like qualities but afraid I
just can't! I think the setting does not do the sculpture any favours
and vice versa. Such a shame and a waste. The other day I was walking around with visitors who went off on their own for a bit and then came back and told me their concerns about the vase and bin sited next to each other. I haven't yet found this interesting anomaly - so that I can raise an official concern - has it been corrected? Can you imagine the historical photos in years to come... family groupings near a vase and litter bin. Hmm. Caroline Tresman <[email protected]> Derby, UK - Thursday, February 03, 2025 at 17:23:58 (GM Author's comment: I agree with most of what you are saying, however, the emphasis was, as claimed by the project management, to be on the restoration "of the original 1840 plan". However this appears to have been very selective as the replacement of original seats, statues and vases/urns has been ignored. As to the excuse that there are insufficient funds for such items, where is the justification for spending around 13,000 (amount quoted in the local press) on a sculpture that has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on a historical restoration? And as you so tactfully put it, something that one would wish to remove from one's shoe. Funereal vases? Yes I checked up on Victorian Cemetery furniture and this plain style is used in Victorian cemeteries, they are called Urns when fitted with a lid. Chris Harris - Web Author
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| And another thing! The external
railings round the Rose Hill Rec. Thank goodness they are no longer the
colour they were but... I chatted to the painters when they were doing
the sand blasting. At that point they told me that the original paint
colour had been specially analysed and the railings were to be painted
in its original green livery. The greenish undercoat went on. Next thing
they were being painted black so I asked them about it and was told that
the original green was going to cost something like 60 (or was
it 80) a can, so it was decided (quite rightly) that it was too
expensive and to go for black instead. What I wonder is why the
management didn't just go for a near-fit off-the-shelf green? Anyway, my
quibble is not that the railings are black but that the black is already
coming off and the undercoat is coming through. We've not even hit the
summer and high usage time and the colour is already chipping. Caroline Tresman <[email protected]> Derby, UK - Thursday, February 03, 2025 at 17:31:35 (GMT) |
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| Dave
I have asked the council and the contractors for explanations. To me it seems that there was initially a plan, which has now broken down into a "just finish it off" attitude. I do know that the railings around the fountain are under scrutiny, I have had several comments from parents with small children who are concerned about the low railings both around the fountain and elsewhere. I have provided the council with a drawing of the railing style for the fountain. I have been told that they are running out of money! Why did they not replace the historical/traditional fencing before wasting money on irrelevant modern art forms? There are many questions to be answered. Chris Harris, Web Author.
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| 'The new gates from Rose Hill...
look more like factory gates than park gates, the style to which all the
other gates conform' I agree - but why is this? There seems to be a complete lack of overall style to the renovation work. We have vaguely traditional fencing contrasting with the decidedly modern 'shin cripplers'; we have a beautifully restored Orangery with those mix and match glass doors; we have a wonderous array of park lighting - and as for the traditional uplighters... And, though I have commented on this elsewhere, why have we eschewed the perpendicular and opted for glorious asymmetry - it just don't look or feel right. Dave Dave Johnson UK - Tuesday, February 01, 2025 at 07:58:11 (GMT) |
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| Surely no more shocked Kate than
the supposed tens of thousands for the manky bit of paving outside the
HOTP buildings which, correct me if I'm wrong, have been relayed four
times! Where does all the money go? Dave Dave Johnson UK - Saturday, January 29, 2025 at 15:50:14 (GMT) |
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| I was shocked and incredulous to
see the cost of the modern sculpture. When I first saw it, I thought it
must be some kind of joke, or perhaps an educational curiosity like a
fossil dinosaur dropping on loan from the Natural History Museum?
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(I) have nagging doubts that in all
the work undertaken that any attention will have been given to the
fundamental drainage problems that for years now have led to impassable
flooding of several pathways and park entrances.' |
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| Dave
Having spoken with Maxwell over the phone recently, I feel it is important to note that he has always supported and fought for the return of the Florentine Boar. It appears that a cheaper option could have been found in Italy, however my own communications with Florence's only remaining artistic foundry, that the prices are now considerably higher Check the link to the Foundry in question for more details Florentine Foundry. Maxwell also agrees that money should also have been spent on the replacement of other artifacts such as original seating (replicas are available from a Coventry manufacturer, and vases, which are available from several dealers in reproduction antiques. Chris Harris (Website Author) |
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I thought Maxwell Craven's recent piece in the DET about the replacement costs of the Florentine Boar statue were spot on and summed up perfectly my long held belief that a significant portion of the vast amount of money spent of the Arboretum refurbishments has either been wasted on poor quality workmanship or misdirected into schemes in which the local residents (and principle users) have little or no interest.
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| What do you think of this new sculpture? Read the article and submit your comments. | |
| What
clap-trap is this? Who are English Heritage to pontificate on what, if
any, sculpture should be displayed in the Arboretum. Yes, we may well be
grateful to them for their involvement in securing funding for the long
overdue attention paid to this handsome and historic park and, yes,
grateful too for their expertise in details of the restoration but they
are not curators of a museum. This is a living creative space gifted to
the people of Derby for, lest English Heritage forget Joseph Strutt's
words, 'the instruction of our population' and that 'collections of
Works of Art, and Exhibitions for Instruction or Amusement' should 'be
thrown open to the public'. Strutt's clear intention was that the
Arboretum should serve to educate and instruct. For that reason the
statues of Asclepios and Hygeia and the Florentine Boar to which
you refer elsewhere on the site were significant additions to the park's
landscape. Personally, the replacement of these lost artefacts is of
less importance now than the addition of some reasonably contemporary
sculpture. I therefore applaud the addition of the piece now positioned
on the Grove Street entrance triangle. I only trust that, of the 13,000
budget, 12,500 went to the artist and 500 to the installation and
not, as I suspect, the other way round. This is exactly what the Lottery
money if for. However, I must take issue, before I close, with the
assumption that such work need represent anything. If the work was a
commission then, yes, it may well have been inspired by its location.
But need we know more than that? Suffice that it works, is pleasing to
the eye and yet challenges us to make our own associations between its
form and the natural forms that surround it. Dave Johnson UK - Monday, December 13, 2024 at 23:54:32 (GMT) Top of Page
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| This
sculpture does not belong here, the lottery money was intended for a
historical restoration and not for some artist to make his mark. The
original statues should be recreated so that we can see a real
restoration. artists making these sculptures should get their own
funding and display their art at recognised galleries, next we will be
seeing half a cow hanging in the orangery or an unmade bed being
displayed in Grove Street Lodge.
Mike Burns UK - Tuesday, December 14, 2024 at 06:34:12 (GMT) |
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| Thanks
Mike - a prompt, if clichd, riposte to my posting. Now that we have
the debate started with two such polarised views let's hope that others
join in. On a related note, the site elsewhere mentions that the plinth for the Florentine Boar is in storage but requires repair after vandal damage. It certainly was knocked askew on its base by the frequent ramming by the stolen/abandoned cars that scarred the Arboretum latterly. However, I recall that I witnessed that the most significant damage, the loss of a sizeable chunk off on corner, was made, not by vandals, but by one of the contractors involved in the laying of the since-removed paving and low railings around the plinth some years ago. Dave Johnson <[email protected]> UK - Tuesday, December 14, 2024 at 17:27:14 (GMT) |
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| Heart
of the Park There's pointing... and there's EXTREME pointing! What is this all about? Dave Johnson UK - Thursday, December 16, 2024 at 12:36:22 (GMT) |
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| Comment
from the web author
This is something that I have expressed concern about - if I have been given accurate information, the answer is unbelievable if not bordering on the surreal: The building looked fine and the contractors had completed the work, then they were told that something was wrong. Apparently the mortar was of the wrong type as it did not match the existing buildings in the area, something to do with pebbles in the mix being the wrong size or something like that. The bricks are specially reproduced "Derby Reds", as used in surrounding buildings so that the building "blends in".Not that this matters too much because the building is outside the historical area. So the Arboretum has a piece of modern abstract art at one end, that does not reflect anything of the park's past, not a problem? They build a modern building in the Rose Hill Rec. and hope that by using old style bricks no one will notice that the building is not actually one of the original buildings. - Oh bother! The mortar gives the game away, everyone will immediately spot the error in the type of mortar used, the size of the pebbles gives the game away (unless you forgot your Sherlock Holmes style magnifier) and will quickly realize that this is in fact a MODERN building! Chris Harris Web Author/Historian |
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| Nice one Chris - far
too esoteric for me though! Do the contractors not realise that,
whatever their rationalisation, the whole thing simply looks like a
shambles to the everyday users of the Arboretum and makes them a
laughing-stock? Part of the problem, as I have commented elsewhere, is that we are not used to being in such close proximity to a building site and that usually these antics take place out of sight behind shuttering. But the whole deal does beg so many questions about quality control etc. that must surely be an embarrassment to the contractors' management much of which could be avoided with better communication. Or do they think we don't notice. By the way I will be taking a spirit level out with me next to check out the new benches. T omy eye several seem to have a forward rake that will make sitting on them most uncomfortable. I will keep you posted unless you get there before me. Cheers Top of Page |
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| As I suspected al of the benches I have checked have a significant forward rake. Why is this? Does it not make them uncomfortable to use? Also, while was out and about with my trusty spirit level, I checked several of the new urns and lamp-posts. Almost without exception these stray from the vertical. Is this deliberate. If so, why? Answers on a postcard please... | |
| I
get the feeling that the seats have deliberately been made uncomfortable
to sit on so that we don't get people sitting around for too long, and
it is hard to stand bottles on sloping surfaces (drinkers beware).
I asked about the seats and apparently they are supposed to be the same design as the original seats used in 1840. However the consultant's research is sadly lacking in accuracy as the original seats were designed by Joseph Strutt, made of wood and each large enough to seat about four people. (Derbyshire Advertiser, 1890) The seats also look worryingly fragile for an area well known for vandalism - proof of which has already shown with the theft of some trees and shrubs. Some of the urns are leaning more than others, mainly because they have not been bolted down very well. I also have to wonder why on earth litter bins are being placed next to some urns, inviting misuse. As to the authenticity of the style, look at the Urn Page. Chris Harris Web Author/Historian |
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Please note that the views expressed here are not necessarily supported by the author. All comments are of a personal nature and are published with that understanding. |
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